Rohini Nilekani, chairperson of Arghyam, raised R163.5 crore in August by offloading part of her stake in IT major Infosys, which she wants to spend in expanding the domain of her philanthropic work. Governance, transparency and independent media are among the areas she is looking at currently. Nilekani has been working in the water and sanitation sector in India since 2005 and Arghyam has set aside a fund of R250 crore for initiatives around water and sanitation. Here, she talks to Darlington Jose Hector and Anand J on themes close to her heart like water, ecology and social entrepreneurship.
Can water distribution be privatised? Can we do these things on a for-profit basis when most parts of the water ecosystem is heavily subsidised by the state?
We haven?t taken an official ideological position on this. Our vision is equity and sustainability. If these two things can be taken care of, it does not matter who is doing it?whether it is a community or the state or the market. But what we have seen over the past decade is that both the government and corporates can be mightily oppressive. Will it be profitable for a private player to get into water distribution? For that we will have to have good concessionaires between the state and the private parties. For the citizens, this has to be equitable and sustainable and also be seen as equitable and sustainable. But, please show me where this has been met well. Europe is moving the onus of water supply ecosystem back to the public sector, because it is very hard for market to look at equity issues. Rather than a whole chain, some parts of the ecosystem may be amenable to be privatised. Total privatisation cannot happen in India. Whose water is it? Who can be entrusted with water on behalf of the public? I don?t see private organisations playing a key role in basic
water management?certainly not asset management.
How do you see the indiscriminate use of groundwater by private parties for profit?
In a way, much of India?s water is already privatised. There are many local entrepreneurs, who are digging bore-wells, taking out the water and selling it to the poor. The whole country has a deeply developed, unregulated water market. Policy has to be effective in the management of groundwater. In Karnataka, there is a government policy but in a country of 23 million bore-wells, it is very difficult to manage. How do you regulate them? Our approach at Arghyam has been to work with partners on what is called participatory groundwater management. In the absence of very clear regulations on ground water usage, the participatory groundwater management has worked in many parts of the world. We are trying to create a network and share best practices. This is not a quick fix. Our partners are also engaging with the state governments wherever necessary.
But rainwater harvesting, necessary for groundwater recharge, is not happening as desired…
When rainwater harvesting was enforced at the household level, it almost reached a crisis situation in Chennai, but has worked well since. In Bangalore, almost 50% of the units are covered. We need people to be willing to implement it. This year we had great rains. But when the case is not so, people will blame the government. The government can make policies in public interest and can implement these things forcefully, but that is not easy in our democracy. What we need is lot more awareness. We have a heavily-subsidised water supply system but the poor still can?t get enough water, which is not obvious to everyone. There has to be a public policy on subsidy, ensuring everyone gets a share and pays on a volumetric basis. Bangalore had more than 200 lakes, even in our recent memory; half of that is gone now. These lakes are rainwater harvesting units. This household rain water harvesting is a burden on lower middle class at an individual level.
How do you see the social impact investment scene in the country, as in social entrepreneurship?
Market opportunity is being created because of government failure. It is good that companies want to create good business models that allow access to these services, but our position is that, with regard to essential services, markets cannot serve the very bottom of the pyramid. Who will reach those who are below the market? For example, people are now buying water-cans costing
R40-80. If the prices go up further, a certain section of the people will not be able to afford it. It is sad that Tamil Nadu government is creating bottled water rather than creating universal piped water supply. The ecological cost of this scheme is very high. For hosing down their lawns, people must be forced to pay penal rates. Basic potable water must be available to all. If government is not ahead of the curve in terms of drafting adequate policies, you can suddenly have a backlash as happened with micro-finance.
But with CSR now being mandatory, do you think this will
grow further?
I am very curious to know how the government is going to define social business. Some of us have opposed this compulsory 2% pay out. I don?t think this is the right thing to do at all. Now that it is a law, we are trying to make sure that the money is
spent well. The amount of R10,000-15,000 crore (to be derived from CSR) is like a big government scheme.
How do you plan to spend the amount of money (R163 crore) that you recently raised by selling part of your stake in Infosys? Are you looking to expand Arghyam?
Our India Water Portal is becoming a tool worldwide for information, a one-stop place about water in India. We have been doing work on water and sanitation for the past few years through our partners. We were also thinking of food and nutrition because it was a natural extension of what we are already doing on water. We have come up with some good models, some of which have been taken up by the government. But there are other areas where I feel Indian philanthropy should really step up, where, earlier, international foundations used to work. People are stepping away because government has been not taking kindly to dissent, which is not a healthy sign. We have also seen pressure on organisations not to fund this or that project. So all this money, over time, will go into governance, ecological restoration, independent media and so on.
Have you ever thought of entering mainstream corporate life?
Now I am completely unemployable for anything at all . If it was not for my marriage, I would have continued as a journalist because I enjoyed it.
You also tried to bring corporates on one stage for social work?
So, the Uncommon Ground was that. Even with Arghyam, we tried to do that. We talk to corporates and they approach us as well. I believe that we need these platforms to bridge the divide between corporates and civil society. Often people have same goals but different paths. Understanding of how the other side is thinking is critical, and in a democracy, we cannot afford polarisation. The middle class is getting re-politicised, which is a good thing. There was a lost decade where the student community and middle class got completely depoliticised. Bubbles are getting created and you are just believing what you are following. It is like an echo chamber. I think we need more platforms which bring together differing groups. The American shutdown is an illustration of what a binary polarisation can do to the country.
Have you ever considered joining public life?
Like politics? I don?t think I am the right kind of person. I am too impulsive to join politics.
Are you happy that your husband, Nandan Nilekani, is looking at it?
Let?s see. I would certainly say that across all political parties, many good people are coming to politics. Right now, whatever the Twitterati might say, corruption is not the differentiator in politics. Aam Aadmi Party is very new. But corruption happens when you are in power, not when you are outside it. We need reforms, for instance, on electoral funding. I hope in this general election, hundreds of good people who have a nuanced sense of India, enter politics. And we will all be grateful to these good people across parties.
When you were discussing this with Nandan, were you worried?
We will figure out what is happening very soon. Let us wait for that to happen?if it happens. It will be premature to discuss anything about it now. Right now, his job involves the UIDAI.
